Choose timezone
Your profile timezone:
erd107: Planning meeting
→
US/Eastern
Description
Join Zoom Meeting
https://cern.zoom.us/j/66394388275?pwd=c0lMVFVzWVBBNHFzS08ydmZvMHZxZz09
Meeting ID: 663 9438 8275
Passcode: CaloEIC
Phone connection:
Find your local number:
https://cern.zoom.us/u/ccKGDo08N2
Meeting ID: 663 9438 8275
Passcode: 07862
########################################################################################################
minutes erd107 planning meeting 09/06/'22:
########################################################################################################
participants:
Friederike Bock - ORNL, eRD107 coordination/ calo convenor
Oskar Hartbrich - ORNL, tile testing/devel
Adam Gibson-Even - valparaiso, member of star fcs hcal (tiles, slowcontrol)
Alexander Kiselev - BNL, lvl3 CAM , simulations, reconstruction
Bill Ilope - Wayne State, looking to participate in EIC hardware projects. recently participated in ALICE TPC/BTU project.
Christine Nattrass - UTK, recently shifting towards sPhenix/EIC, "providing semi-skilled labor"
Craig Woody - BNL, sPhenix at the moment
Jim Freeman - FNAL, scintillator development & production group. extruded, injection molded scintillators (currently CMS)
Ken Read - UTK/ORNL group leader
Megan Connors - GSU, lvl3 manager sPhenix HCAL tiles, testing locally at (?)
Miguel Arratia - UC Riverside
Nico Schmidt - ORNL, calo simulations
Norbert Novitzky - ORNL, HGCROC based calo readout electronics
Oleg Tsai - UCLA, eRD106 forward ECAL
Peter Steinberg - BNL group lead, trying to find fit of BNL group within EPIC detector
Ryan Milton - UC Riverside, hadron endcap simulations in ATHENA proposal, now working on forward hcal insert
Tim Rinn - BNL, background in sPhenix ECAL, looking for ways to get involved in EPIC
########################################################################################################
Friederike Bock introduction:
########################################################################################################
- general problem with eRD107/LFHCAL is fine line between what constitutes R&D and what is already project development (PD). We have been told to simply ask for what we need for now, then figure out what is assigned as R&D or PD afterwards
- plans for next year eRD107 (see draft of eRD107 for details)
- machined tile prototypes
- injection molded tiles
- automatic tile assembly (fiber insertion) via robot instead of (under)grad work
- sensor board (SiPM carrier board)
- reco/optimization
- LFHCAL mechanics
- test beam & tile testing
- total requested budget so far: 125k. some additional money might be available due to inflation act (30-50K), main reason for meeting is to manage additional requests
------------------------------
discussion
------------------------------
Peter Steinberg: eRD106/107/109 seem tightly coupled in many ways, will it really be three separate projects with separate oversight?
- Fredi/Ken: scope of 109 is not entirely clarified yet and we will find out what can be included there. Internally have strong communication and coupling between 106/107/109 of course (i.e. Oleg joins this 107 meeting). Norbert is contact for 109 matters, Fredi for 107, Oleg for 106
Peter Steinberg: do we plan for more scheduled discussions between now and submission?
- Fredi: hoped for at most one additional, but can schedule and discuss as needed
Ken Read: recommend to work out how mature does a testbeam towards FY23 need to be so that project leadership would agree to funding it. Put big deliverables first, then work backwards to see what is needed
- Fredi: real testbeam module + analysis will not be possible before CD2. so instead aiming for tile characterization and "small module" instead
Megan Connors: do we plan TB at CERN or FNAL? CERN much more expensive of course.
- Fredi: depends on availability
Miguel Arratia: would be interested to provide some in-kind activities. Would prefer to adjust wording to not preclude LFHCAL insert, include possibility of insert in mechanical designs etc.
- Fredi: of course
- Ken: at the moment do not have "full project permission" to include insert in designs, but fully supports not precluding it in designs etc.
Peter Steinberg: where is the demarkation line between R&D and PD?
- Fredi: we also do not fully understand the demarkation line. Thomas Ullrich indicated not to aim for PD too much right now, Rolf Ent indicated to simply ask for what we need, then the project will see how to provide such funds. Hope to get more detailed information on R&D/PD from project soon.
########################################################################################################
Norbert slides on HGCROC based LFHCAL R&D for eRD109 (see attached slides)
########################################################################################################
------------------------------
discussion
------------------------------
Ken: HGCROC plans have been presented to project and discussed in DAQ status review and were received well.
########################################################################################################
general discussion
########################################################################################################
Oleg: question on tiles: Main goal of tile R&D is to finalize tile production mechanism. Do you have expectations of tile lightyield with "baseline" machined tiles?
- Fredi/Oskar: 8-10pixel/MIP looks feasible and achievable. 2006 CALICE AHCAL prototype had similar tile+wavelength shifting fiber design and had 11-12 px/MIP.
Oleg: Do you have any idea whether injection molding is even possible for this design?
- Fredi/Oskar: That's why we do R&D on this. We simply don't know yet. Definitely needs careful design of mold and input from experience injection molding manufacturer, hence involvement of FNAL scintillator group/Jim Freeman.
Oleg: How far do you think you will get with only a single injection mold/test run budgeted in this R&D?
- Fredi/Oskar: injection molded tiles are high risk, but very high reward, so high expectation value. Would clearly be beneficial to be able to budget more than one mold production / test run.
- Jim: will contact the mold manufacturer for initial price estimate, will try to budget from there.
########################################################################################################
Way forward (submission deadline: Oct 1st)
########################################################################################################
Fredi: Everybody takes the next week to go through proposal. Feel free to directly edit in overleaf (track changes is enabled), comment there or send comments by mail.
editing link: https://www.overleaf.com/6189575146hskrpsqkxtdt
Fredi: Feel free to adjust funding requests and/or add new tasks, we will readjust full funding request afterwards accordingly.
There are minutes attached to this event.
Show them.
